Thirtysomething and Never Been Kissed? Getouttahere!
A writing acquaintance of mine posted the following in her (very lovely) review of Menu for Romance:
The only part that didn’t quite ring true to me is that Meredith could have gone 34 years without one date, let alone a kiss.
I couldn’t let that go without commenting upon it, so I posted the following response:
Well, the author has gone thirty-eight years without one date, let alone a kiss, so it does happen in real life—and more often than most people realize.
And I’m not talking about those who are involved in the “Virgin Lips” or “Purity” movements. I’m talking about normal, everyday women, Christian or not, who’ve never been asked out on a date (though we’d really like to be) and who’ve never been kissed (though we’d really like to be).
A couple of weeks ago, I posted a diatribe on the new Fox “reality” show More to Love in which I mentioned hearing many of those women, in their twenties and thirties, remark that they’ve never dated and that some have never been kissed. But surely, most viewers must be thinking, the producers had to search high and low for these women. Either that or they’re lying about it. Because as everyone knows, every woman in this country has not only dated but has surely been kissed before she’s—what? twenty? eighteen? sixteen?
When Susan Boyle came to prominence on Britain’s Got Talent earlier this year, all one had to do was look at her to understand why she’d never dated, never been kissed, right? I mean, that’s what everyone was saying on the blogs and in the in the tabloids. With someone who isn’t the western world’s idea of attractive/beautiful, it’s easy to categorize them and shove them off to the side and believe they’d never “get” someone simply because they’re not good looking enough. In this blogger’s post, the information that Susan Boyle admitted to—being single, living alone (with a cat), and never having been kissed—is classified as “self-deprecating facts.” Since when did being single, supporting one’s self to the point of being able to live alone, and never having gone through a horrible experience with a bad relationship just to mark “first kiss” and “have a boyfriend” off our life’s to-do list become “self-deprecating”?
I know there are people who will look at pictures of me—having been a size 16 when I graduated from high school (at 5’9″) and now at a size 22/24 (though two years ago barely fit into a size 28)—and put me in the same category with the Susan Boyles of the world. But I’m proud of the fact that I’ve never dated. I’m proud of the fact I’ve never been kissed. I’m proud of the fact that I don’t have the baggage of past relationships to drag around with me, to damage my view of what falling in love is all about. Because I wouldn’t be able to write the books I write if I had to lug all that garbage around with me.
But heaven forbid a woman of average height who fits into a size 10 pants with strawberry blonde hair, nutmeg-brown eyes, a pretty face, and a six-figure income should have gotten to the grand old age of thirty-four without ever having been asked out on a date or been kissed. It’s unthinkable! Especially in the modern culture of American Christianity, where everyone knows that it’s a young woman’s job to date as much as possible so she can find her husband as young as possible so she can start popping out as many babies as possible, right? I mean, come on now, right? That’s why most Christians who are over the age of about thirty-five who aren’t married are no longer attending church regularly. If every unmarried Christian over the age of thirty-five were to go to the church in his or her community on the same Sunday, all the married people/families wouldn’t have room. But because we’ve been marginalized and pushed to the side for years and years—mostly viewed as abnormalities, as people who obviously aren’t living good Christian lives, because otherwise God would have blessed us with marriage and children by now—most of Christian society has forgotten that we exist.
But it may not just be in the churches where we’ve ceased to exist. In this blog post, the blogger brings up the idea that in the past, on TV shows or in movies, there was always the character of the “maiden aunt” or “bachelor uncle.” Usually as a comic relief, or sometimes as a parental substitute in stories in which the children had bad relationships with their parents. But in the last twenty or thirty years, the fact that someone could have survived into adulthood without having been in a romantic (and/or sexual) relationship with someone AND who isn’t lesbian/gay has pretty much been wiped out of all media—whether TV, movies, or books. One might argue that the chick-lit genre celebrates the single woman. Sort of. But how many of those characters (a) have never dated/been kissed or (b) aren’t actively dating/looking for someone to date/falling in love?
Since being published, the question as to why I write romance novels invariably comes up in interviews. Here’s my standard answer:
My heart is, as it has been for more than twenty years, focused on writing light-hearted romances. But not just any romances. I like writing characters who represent a growing segment of the population that seems to be increasingly left out in Christian circles: women in their late-twenties, thirties, and early-forties (and even older) who have never been married and who want to be loved and accepted for who they are, not pigeon-holed into a category, labeled, or, as happens most often, shoved to the side and ignored/forgotten about by their churches, coworkers, or even friends and family. I’m writing to the women who, like me, expected to be married before they turned twenty-five (-six, -seven, -eight . . .), but who may find themselves now in their mid- to late-thirties or forties and have never even had a date or meaningful relationship.
I’m writing for them (me, actually) so we can hang on to the hope of finding a well-adjusted, loving, marriage-minded Christian man out there somewhere and having a “happily ever after” ending with him (with the optimism that he may be closer than we realize). I’m writing for the woman who, like me, feels most alone when she goes to church and sees all the married/engaged couples and families sitting together; who has to endure the family-focused activities, Bible studies, Sunday school lessons, and sermons (if you’ve never noticed, start keeping track of how often your pastor talks about families and/or marriage); who begins to feel it isn’t just the church that has pushed her aside and forgotten about her, but that maybe God has too.
Apparently my books are getting into the hands of these targeted readers—if the e-mails that I’m getting are any indication. While I once believed I was unique—perhaps one of a kind—in this world where it seems like happiness depends solely on “hooking up” with someone else (whether permanently or temporarily), I’m finding that there are many more kindred spirits out there who are like me: never dated, never been kissed. Some are okay with it, some are heartbroken by it. But all of them are my sisters.
In response to a comment left on the More to (Not) Love post, I wrote this: While I would love to find “Mr. Right” and perhaps get married one of these years, I’ve learned to be content with the life God’s given me. As long as I have companionship—in whatever form it comes—I’m satisfied. The rest would be “gravy.”
And that is why Meredith Guidry is thirty-four years old and has never dated nor been kissed.
Comments are closed.
KayeDacus.com 
Well-written! I whole heartedly agree with you in that there are MANY women out there who live similar lives. I’m just glad that there are articulate women, like you, to vocalize those feelings for those who are unable to do so themselves.
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This is a great post, Kaye. I confess, I’m the one who wrote that review and expressed disbelief that Meredith had never been kissed. Perhaps I should explain myself… I’m a person who wishes I’d been kissed a little less. I now have a fabulous husband (of almost 18 years) but on my way to finding him, I had several not-so-good, painful relationships. I wish I would had avoided that icky emotional baggage and waited for the special union God had planned for me. And I know a lot of women with the same story. So I guess I find it hard to relate to a smart woman who managed to escape that “I need a man” trap. But I applaud her, and any other woman, who has the self-respect and good sense to want God’s best in her life and actually do something about it. Thanks, Kaye, for writing what you do, as well as you do. Be blessed!
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It’s not necessarily so much a choice to get to this age with the no date/no kiss track record. For most of us, it’s simply because there’s never been an opportunity.
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Indeed! Well put. I’m in the same boat. It was also hard to believe that anyone else like me could exist and I believed I was the only one. This is why I objected to the comments about Susan Boyle.
I’m 29, average size (petite/average; size 4), and there is objectively nothing wrong with me. I am also a Phd candidate, speak 4 languages, and will be an academic soon.
I live with a cat too. I have friends-females and males alike-but I am not a socialite.
I have never dated, never been kissed, never held hands. And it was because the opportunity NEVER came up, not that it was a choice.
So it has nothing to do with looks, it’s just pure luck I’d say!
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Kaye, you’ve made some good points. I was 33 when I married Daniel. Few people who didn’t know me pre Daniel assumed it was my second (or more) marriage. But it’s my first marriage. I do understand a little of what you’re describing because I’ve never had a child. It’s like I’m a failure as a woman because I’ve never given birth. Seriously?
And you are right, now that you’ve brought it to my attention, that most sermons are about marriage or how to improve your marriage or something about the nuclear family.
But one thing I think many Christians today forget-wasn’t it Paul who taught that it’s better to remain celibate to focus on God? Didn’t he say that’s the better choice. But that if you’re weak and can’t live that life, it’s better to get married than to sleep around. Didn’t he even advocate for celibate periods during marriage when each partner should focus on God and seek His will?
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1 Corinthians 7:1–5 (NASB):
Now concerning the things about which you wrote, it is good for a man not to touch a woman. But because of immoralities, each man is to have his own wife, and each woman is to have her own husband. The husband must fulfill his duty to his wife, and likewise also the wife to her husband. The wife does not have authority over her own body, but the husband does; and likewise also the husband does not have authority over his own body, but the wife does. Stop depriving one another, except by agreement for a time, so that you may devote yourselves to prayer, and come together again so that Satan will not tempt you because of your lack of self-control.
1 Corinthians 7:32–35 (NASB):
But I want you to be free from concern. One who is unmarried is concerned about the things of the Lord, how he may please the Lord; but one who is married is concerned about the things of the world, how he may please his wife, and his interests are divided. The woman who is unmarried, and the virgin, is concerned about the things of the Lord, that she may be holy both in body and spirit; but one who is married is concerned about the things of the world, how she may please her husband. This I say for your own benefit; not to put a restraint upon you, but to promote what is appropriate and to secure undistracted devotion to the Lord.
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“I’m proud of the fact that I don’t have the baggage of past relationships to drag around with me, to damage my view of what falling in love is all about.”
You don’t really believe that, do you? Past relationships are not baggage, they are what make you who you are, and you can’t have a mature relationship and *really* know what falling in love is about, not just having a view, without risking a “past” relationship. Every relationship is a potential mature or past relationship. Frankly, saying “oh, whatever God wants” or “I’ve never had the chance” is a cop out.
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In my experience, observing the people around me as they’ve gone through multiple relationships—some good, some bad—as well as marriages, yes, it is my opinion that relationships come with baggage. The first argument. The first breakup. The first time he forgets my birthday or our anniversary. That’s baggage. Breakups—baggage. Divorce. MAJOR baggage. As a romance writer, I don’t have the danger of coming up with a character that’s too much like ex-boyfriend-number-three and getting distracted by reliving all of the bad things that happened that ended the relationship. Because I’ve always had good relationships with men (deep friendships), I’m able to focus on what it is that I admire and like about them instead of how they’ve hurt me in the past.
And whether you like it or not, I have never been on a date nor been kissed because I’ve never had a chance. As I said, I’ve always had good relationships with men. But they were always friendship, even the one man I consider myself having been in love with when I was twenty-one years old. No man I’ve ever known has ever asked me on a date. No man I’ve ever known has ever tried to kiss me. So it’s not a cop-out to say that. It’s the truth, plain and simple.
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Great post! I’ve wanted to see something like that for a while. And I agree, a lot of times people who are always jumping from one relationship to the next has a lot of baggage that they have to deal with. I’ve seen it in tons of my friends, and the sad part is they develop bad habits too. At least mine did. Plenty would have a guy waiting in the wings before the broke up with the one they were with. I was like you can’t do that in marriage, and you shouldn’t even do that now. Plus many wouldn’t even respect a regular girlfriend/boyfriend relationship, they’d break the couples up and their reasoning would be they weren’t married, but that wasn’t a good reason if you ask me.
Also, I know people who have never dated and never kissed, not because they weren’t asked, but because it just hadn’t felt right yet. And there isn’t really a stereo type for how a person looks to have not dated or kissed, because many beautiful people don’t because they’re not sure what the person asking is after. A lot of people think just because someone is beautiful that they’ll do or have done things and it’s just not true. Plus, a lot of times if you’re in a relationship and you’re not heading toward marriage or committed to it you’ll do things you later regret. A lot of authors will write about that also.
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I watched another one of those “light-hearted romance” movies, on Hallmark, I think, the other night that had as one of the core conflicts of the story that the woman was engaged to a man that the audience could see was clearly wrong for her—but aside from being a workaholic, he was such a nice guy and seemed committed to making things work with her. Even though I knew he was wrong for her, and that the fireman who saved her life was right for her (after all, I know this story structure pretty well by now), and even though she and the fiancé came to a mutual agreement to not get married (0n their wedding day—and off screen), it still bothered me—the whole, I’m engaged and am going to go ahead and go through with the wedding (almost)…but there’s someone else in the wings I’ve been having an emotional affair with. Just like with The Wedding Planner (the impetus for my writing Stand-In Groom), it made me wonder how soon after the woman and the fireman get together she’s going to meet someone else and start having an emotional affair with him while still involved with the fireman. (This is where the totally unromantic side of me comes out.)
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I think this is awesome, Kaye. I just wish more people would wake up and realize that people who’ve never had a date/been kissed are normal people. I thought that was one of the most awesome things about Susan Boyle (besides her voice) was the fact that she shared something that most people might have wanted to put under the rug. I applaud women who are not afraid to admit it.
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I was listening to a program on NPR Sunday, which I almost always listen to. It’s one on which they discuss music, arts, and film. The host was talking to filmmaker Judd Apatow, and asked him why most of his films were about “losers—like a forty-year-old virgin.”
Just as I’m proud of the fact that I don’t have all that past-relationship baggage to carry around with me, I’m extremely proud of the fact that I’m thirty-eight years old and a virgin. And I plan to remain one until or if I ever get married. It saddens me to see that popular culture tells young women that they’re abnormal if they aren’t having sex regularly by the time they graduate from high school—ironic, since the opposite was true (at least the mindset if not the reality) just twenty years ago when I graduated from high school. You have to understand: I had a pretty liberal sex-education when I was younger. My parents were very frank about it, especially in talking about contraceptives, even though it was their desire that we (my sister and I) waited until we got married. Because of their openness and frankness, I believe it took away that aura of mystery that leads so many young people down that road.
The problem with getting most people to admit we’ve never dated or that we’ve never been kissed is just that: it’s now seen to be abnormal. And who wants to be abnormal? I never cease to be amazed when I meet readers who are shocked to discover I’m not married. They assume, since I write what I write and since I’m an adult, Christian female, that I must be married. I’m glad I’ve been able to start breaching some stereotypes!
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Powerful post. Thanks for making yourself vulnerable, Kaye. You have the gift of articulation, like Analisa said above, putting into words what other women have felt but haven’t known how to vocalize. Sharing from your heart is gift to others.
I was an anomaly just to make it into college without having been on a date or been kissed – never asked, in spite of close friendships with guys. That was a blessing to my husband, that I was able to give my first date, first holding-hands, first kiss, to him.
I just finished Menu a couple days ago. I don’t know how much I can say here without spoilers! I’ll just stick with, “I enjoyed it!” for now. And your casting picture for Meredith is very much how I imagined her.
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I’m finding that the older I get, the more I’m opening up about things that I’ve kept to myself for most of my life. It started with the writing ten years ago, then last year it was the weight-loss struggle issue (with the start of my other blog, which, no, hasn’t been updated in a couple of weeks). I guess I’m getting to the point that, since I don’t have someone here at home to be open and vulnerable with, it’s actually healthy for me to spill it all publicly—and it’s amazing how many people I’m hearing back from who’re finally seeing they’re not alone in the world.
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Your comment about churches excluding singles is interesting, Kaye. I wonder if part of it is a regional trend. I grew up in the Midwest and my husband grew up in the Carolinas, both regions where early marriage is accepted and encouraged. We now live in the Seattle area, where marriage is often delayed and parenthood delayed even longer, and to be 25 years old and getting ready to celebrate your third wedding anniversary draws some stares, both in and out of the church. We have a hard time finding couple friends our own age because of this–most couples in our church are older than us (and usually have kids, where we don’t), while those in our age group are mostly single or dating, but not married. Go figure…
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Regionality probably does have a lot to do with it. Here in the Bible Belt, where (within the church) marrying young and having babies early are still considered the norm, that’s the focus of most evangelical churches. Which is why I’m leaning more and more toward the Episcopalian denomination—as they seem to be much more open to people who don’t have that traditional Minivan-and-Three-Kids lifestyle (at least that’s what I’ve found at Christ Church Cathedral in downtown Nashville).
I’ve only met one other never-been-married person my age at the Baptist church at which I’m a member. He’s the organist. There’s a huge ministry for the “young professionals”—married and single. And there’s a “Divorce Care” group (which used to be called the “singles” class—I visited once. Everyone was in their 50s or older, and, as the name change suggests, previously married and divorced). Even though the church is one of the larger churches in Nashville, there is NO singles class, no ministry for people who’ve never been married who are over the age of 30 (which is about where the YP class cuts off). Is it any wonder I’d rather just watch the service on TV on Sunday mornings than go and be reminded of how my church doesn’t minister to my needs?
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This is so true. At church we had a bible study group for children (circa 6-12), for teenagers (circa 12-18), for young men and women (circa 18-22), young couples, mothers and men. For a woman (33 years old) who is not married there is simply no group. The people I used to socialise with have moved away or are now in a relationship and have joined the couples group. And it’s not just church. They stop inviting you for social events as well…sometimes because it is considered odd when everyone else at the table has a partner, except you. They don’t want awkward situations, don’t want you to feel left out and therefore decide not to invite you at all. I have now accepted that as soon as one of my friends tell me they have a boyfriend and it’s pretty serious, it probably means I have lost them. I will keep trying to stay a good friend, but it is better to know beforehand that they won’t have time to socialise with you any more and probably will distance themselves from you. Maybe not on purpose but it will happen. I wish they would accept single people more!
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I totally agree and was just saying that same thing the other day. It is really tough to be single in the church after a certain age. You kind of have to count on the fact that you will have to go it alone most of the time. It is really painful for me to accept that sometimes but I also have to see that it is God’s will and therefore I have all of the strength and support I need to do so. It is just a matter of finding the resources for that strength and support.
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This was a wonderful post! I’m 23 and the everday average size 10 girl and I’ve never been on a date or kissed. I’m totally okay with it! I just hate it when people try to “hook me up” with other guys thinking that I need to get married right away since I’m now finished with college. I guess I went to college to get a degree in husband hunting 😛 and since I graduated I need to get to it! I’m not in a hurry, when/if the right person comes along, I hope I’ll know!
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Hold out for the best, and you won’t be disappointed!
I, too, get tired of the mindset from others that because I’m not married, I can’t possibly be happy with my life. So it just makes my want to try even harder to be successful in what I’ve chosen to do and to show that I am, for the most part, content with my life. (With finances being the one big area of discontentment—but that’s to be expected when one is self-employed and would rather give things up and live on a shoestring budget than have to go back to work full-time!)
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I’ll just say “OUCH!” (for all of us who are dated some, kissed once or twice, and are happily married with two kids and a minivan! And no I am not a size 10 (I wish)!
Kaye, you are just how God created you and that is enough for me! 🙂
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Well, we both know that if God does intend for me to marry, He’s probably still figuring out how to make a guy who’ll be able to handle me!
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Maybe God is still working on “that guy” before HE leads the two of you to meet. ‘Cuz I know how PERFECT you are….there just must be something wrong with the guy! 🙂
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Amen Kaye!
I have actually been on a few dates and even had 2 boyfriends and have never been kissed. The first boyfriend (T)felt that kissing was a “very serious” thing and the other (D) believed in waiting until marriage. The first one we only dated for 2 months, and the 2nd one a little over a year.
I bristled at the commenter who said that its a cop-out when you said you are glad you don’t have the emotional baggage. That’s absurd. Both of my relationships ended badly. (T) had felt bad about breaking up with me and wanted to remain friends but I was so hurt I told him to stay away. About a year or so later I happened to see him and a sorta friend (more than an aquaintance, not quite a friend) standing next to each other. There was no indication that they were together at all but in that moment I knew, I absolute positively knew they were perfect for each other. I immediately forgave him for hurting me. Yes, it turns out that they ended up together and now have two children, but I even lost her as a friend because she never would believe that I didn’t absolutely hate (T) anymore. Which was sad cause I liked her and was so absolutely happy for them. But because he and I dated, I lost not one, but two friends.
The second relationship? Disaster. Total and complete disaster. In many ways though I am glad I went through that one, even though it was pure pain at the time – it taught me how to stand up for myself – maybe not during the relationship but afterwards I realized what some of the problems were and was able to adjust my own way of thinking (no this wasn’t a guy who was beating me up or anything – long story).
So to say that not having emotional baggage is a bad thing bothers me. Greatly. I wish I didn’t have some of the baggage that I have. I’m glad that you are happy where you are.
Over the past two weeks I’ve been seeing a lot of articles addressing the plight of single people in America. I’m hoping that pastors all over the nation will start to recognize what they’ve been doing wrong and will start correct their way of thinking.
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There is something to be said for the experiences we gain in life. However, sometimes I think it’s better to gain knowledge through observation rather than hands-on experience. I didn’t have to disobey my parents on curfew to know how they were going to react—all I had to do was watch my older sister do it I didn’t have to go through the emotions of feeling like I always had to have a boyfriend or else life wasn’t worth living—again, all I had to do was live with my sister until she got married when we were in our early 20s. Sure, I may not have the depth of emotion to fall back on, but I have a pretty good imagination—and I have other experiences in my life that I can use to extrapolate. I mean, I’ve never been a professional chef, but a little research combined with my experience of working in a restaurant for a year made for a pretty believable character.
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I just finished reading Francis Ray’s And Mistress Makes Three. In it, there’s a character who has “never” and she’s in her sixties. Didn’t strike me as strange or unusual at all, though I thought it nice that she makes a connection with a elderly neighbor and that in the story, this relationship doesn’t appear until the very end so it only gets as far as a first date.
Your reality is your reality. It’s a shame that we’re such a judgmental people. I recall how I felt as a young married woman who wasn’t pregnant (not for lack of trying). People can be extremely insensitive and say the darndest things. I had to learn to shrug it off.
I admire your openness, your courage, and the sense that you enjoy life.
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I have a proposal in to Barbour for (hopefully) my next contemporary series—which involves the grandparents meddling in their grandchildren’s love lives. But this discussion has me thinking that for the last book, Turn About’s Fair Play, that I might make the “granny” character a great-aunt who never married and raised her great-nephew (and therefore gave up a lot of opportunities to meet men/date/marry).
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I would love the idea of a great aunt character – made me think of Auntie Mame. 🙂
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Kaye,
What a great post. The pic of one of my favorite TV actresses led me here…one of her shows was a fantastic one for romance fans, no? 🙂
Anyway. I’m so sorry that fellow Christians make anyone feel bad for their marital status. God works in a trillion different ways in people’s lives that together, weave a powerful tapestry of testimony…and beauty. Certainly He intends some to marry young, some to marry older, some to perhaps never marry at all.
I wish we could all go a lot easier on each other in these particulars. Marriage/no marriage; have children young/ wait til you’re older; private school/public school/homeschool. These are the just some of the particulars of life that we should leave up to God and His children. They are private, and not critical to salvation.
(And when you feel out of the mainstream, Kaye, think of this public school teacher who is also a devout Christian! :))
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I’m one of those people who really doesn’t care what someone’s “social status” is, but looks at “who” the person is, on the inside. I wish more Christians could be that way and get beyond all the trappings of what someone looks like, what their social status is (married/single), whether or not they have kids, etc.
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And, it seems like when we’re judgmental, we’re not really showing the world the “abundant life” Jesus promised. We give it lip service, but we don’t live it.
I like the responses you’re getting here, Kaye. Very open and honest.
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Very insightful post Kaye. I didn’t think there was anything strange about Meredith as I’ve had many friends and acquaintance throughout my life and know there’s a full realm of lifestyles.
Singles in the church. With the exception of some newer church plants that start with young singles, singles are often passed over. Part of the problem is many churches have tried singles programs, often run by single volunteers who either bring in their own baggage, can’t deal with all the baggage of the others, or get married and the ministry falters. It is an exception to find churches that have a pastor actively involved with this group, although they are generally pretty involved with the married group. Again, just an observation. My situation is of course different from yours, having married and not chosen well, becoming divorced at age 22 with 2 babies. There are memories and baggage to every relationship in life. Where there is a singles ministry, or at least groups that take in both marrieds and singles, they seem to be focused on the post college through mid-30’s crowd. There is very little for the over 40 population, except maybe Divorce Care, which is an excellent program, but it is certainly not for socialization. And I agree that singles should not be separated, but there are unique needs. If you think there’s not much at your age, it will pretty much disappear after your 40th birthday. I go to a large church in the area, and there are pastors assigned to the ‘college age’ and post college through mid-thirties groups and they meet almost weekly. There is a volunteer who facilitates the over 40’s group and we’re lucky to get together every 6 months (both married and single). I went to the singles group at a megachurch in CA, which did have a pastor assigned, and although they did allow you to attend if you were over 40, it was definitely aimed at the 20 somethings. I was better off at my homegroup at a smaller church. I did facilitate the single moms group for a few years, as single parenting was a different issue. If I ever do it again, it will be a single parents group.
On the other hand, I’ve never had a pastor who didn’t value and love the singles, they just didn’t quite know how to meet the needs and many ended up at megachurches to get their needs met.
OK, rant done.
Blessings,
Anyway,
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Part of the problem I’ve experienced with churches in Nashville, in addition to what I’ve already detailed, is that there is a lot of “social status” that goes along with what church one’s a member of and what social group within the church one is a member of. Even at some of the smaller churches I’ve gone to—but especially at the larger ones. Social groups don’t mix—especially marrieds and singles. It’s easier to cross those boundaries in smaller churches—simply because there just aren’t that many people to hang out with. But as the smaller churches tend to be more conservative, which is somewhat stifling for this “liberal” gal, it’s hard to find that “right” place.
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Not having emotional baggage when coming into a marriage is a VERY GOOD thing. Why would you want to weigh down your husband/wife with all that mess that you could have avoided in the first place?
I was in the never been kissed/never had a boyfriend camp until last fall. My first kiss was the night of December 13, 2008. And I’m going to be 27 this December. I made the decision and commitment at the age of 13 to save my ENTIRE self for my husband. Huston desperately wanted to kiss me the second time we met in person, but I said no. Once I explained myself, he respected that so much that he didn’t try again until he put the ring on my finger. I let him that time and we haven’t stopped since.
I find the whole premise of the movie 40-Year-Old Virgin to be offensive. DH and I had a talk about that very movie a few weeks ago. He’s seen it and I refuse to see it. Virginity is a precious gift that is to be treasured and saved for the one person God created you to be with. It is the single most precious, amazing, valuable gift that you can give your spouse. And it should be treated as such!
I’ve long been of the opinion that the modern dating culture does nothing but prepare one for divorce. Relationships are about commitment, and one shouldn’t enter that commitment until they’re ready to make it for life. I never dated. Huston and I courted, based on a Biblical model and everything we did went through my dad first. Because of that, I entered marriage as prepared as a woman can possibly be. We’ve had a bit of a rocky start, but because we kept ourselves pure for each other we will reap the rewards.
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I’ve always thought that if I ever do marry, he’ll be someone I’ve known and been friends with for a long time—that it would grow naturally out of that trust built through friendship. The interesting thing about that is I’m currently in a season in my life in which I have very few close male acquaintances, much less friends—and most of the acquaintances are married (which is why they’re acquaintances and not friends.) But it’s been during this season (the last couple of years, pretty much since I finished grad school and left the newspaper) that I’ve come around to the realization of what I posted: I’m pretty content with my life, and I’m happy with the companionship I have—which right now happens to be mostly female companionship. The oddest thing of all is that until I hit my 30s, I always found it harder to build friendships with women than with men. Now I’m finding the opposite is true. Part of that is because, as a single woman, I shy away from building relationships with married men. Another part is because I don’t meet single men anymore. I’ve tried the online matchmaking sites, and though there have been a couple of men I’ve communicated with, I just haven’t really felt drawn—intellectually or emotionally—toward any of them. And the third piece is because as I’ve grown older and matured, I’ve become much more confident in who I am as a woman and how to relate with women who may not be anything like me. (Though my closest friends are more like me than not.)
I’m not giving up the hope that someday, I’ll finally get to experience what falling into forever love feels like. But I’m happy to have the opportunity I have right now to be able to concentrate on my writing career.
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my friend becky told me to come read this post…
i didn’t have any baggage to speak of until last year. and then…i got my heart really really broken. and it sucks. and while part of me would say, “i wish i’d never met that dude”…i now have an empathy and patience for friends who are hurting that i PROMISE you cannot have unless you have experienced pain like that.
observation of other people’s lives canNOT give you that kind of empathy. it just can’t.
and for that reason, i can (on some days) feel the slightest bit of gratefulness that i went through that pain…because it means i can be a much, much better friend and love someone the way she needs to be loved.
i haven’t had another relationship since that one ended (and wherein i gave my first kiss at the age of 27 to a guy i’m not really sure cared about me…? which pisses me off ENDLESSLY), and i’m pretty sure i’m going to have trust issues and some baggage navigating those waters that i wouldn’t have without this past relationship. HOWEVER, i also learned a LOT! and there are mistakes that i made in my first relationship that i will know not to make this time. i know plenty of people that married the first person with whom they were involved, so i’m not saying you have to have relationship experience in order to build a successful relationship, but i’m also very aware that it WILL help me in some ways.
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I’ve never claimed to have much empathy for other people, so that’s not an inducement for me to want to go through a bad relationship just so I know what other people experience when they go through it. 🙂 (Seriously, though, I’m an ISTJ personality type, which means that I’m not wired for lots of empathy—or mercy or anything akin to those traits. But I do find it very easy to learn from others’ mistakes.)
I believe I’m better off not having dated at all, since it took me until I was in my early 30s to really figure out who I am as a person. Dating and all the drama and emotional turmoil/self-doubt/self-esteem problems that go along with it would have only served to screw me up worse than I ever was in my earlier years. (And I suffer from cyclical depression—also not good to go along with the downside of dating: breakups.) I have had plenty of heartbreak in my life, including a best friend who not only initiated our friendship (in college) but also promised we’d always be friends and that she’d always be there for me who then, several years later, when I was at a crisis point in my life and needed her most, told me she couldn’t handle my “issues” and was dropping our friendship. A boyfriend couldn’t have taken my heart out and stomped it into pieces any more effectively than she did.
Plus, the whole point of my soapbox rant was to explain why I wrote a character who’s never dated/never been kissed. I have LOTS of experience to draw upon for a character like that.
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Truth is if you count on others to define how happy you are they will always let you down. You have done well all on your own and your happiness in life is NOT dependent on others! That is HUGE. Especially in a world full of co-depents and a lot of miserable people. Keep up the good fight and the rest will fall into place.
Everybody’s life experience is unique. Nobody looks at things in exactly the same way as another person. that is what makes life interesting! Happiness is a choice, and every day no, sometimes moment by moment you may find yourself deciding whether to be happy or not. And you know what? That’s ok. For you being single, unkissed, and undated works. You may not always like it, but you are NOT defined by it. You are who you are good or bad regardless of labels…..That’s why WE are friends….warts and all! 🙂
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Bravo, friend.
To speak to the church fellowship discussion…as a single I am so thankful for the twenties and thirties group at my church, as well as the all-ages womens group. The former is a great mix of singles and marrieds (gotta love those marrieds who haven’t forgotten how to relate to singles! *wink*). I hope you can find a church with just the right niche.
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Yeah, well, you’re lucky that you’re still in your twenties—churches love catering to twentysomething (and even early thirtysomething) singles/young professionals. It’s once you’ve gone past your sell-by date that they start trying to pretend like you’re not there.
The problem with trying to do anything with married people my age is that they almost all have young children—ranging in age from babies/toddlers to teenagers. Because I’m not a “kid person”—as in, I’d rather hang out and communicate with adults without having to listen to stories about their kids (their toilet training, their first day of school, their sports teams, their bedtime routines, any of their other issues), I find that I don’t always have a lot to talk about in a room full of thirty- and fortysomething married people. There are exceptions—there always are. And I do have plenty of married friends whom I get along with just fine. But we’re limited as to the amount of time we can spend together because, as it should be, their main attention needs to be on their family.
I’m sure I’ll eventually find the right place.
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I find it interesting that so many people claim having one’s heart broken gives one a broader perspective, more empathy, etc. I think there are a lot of people who come out of a bad relationship as a better person, but some people don’t. Some people become bitter, take refuge in constant one-liners that disparage the opposite sex, can’t be happy for friends who find supportive partners, etc. If they date “the right person,” their attitude can lead them to sabotage their relationship. God protects some people’s hearts for a reason.
I never liked those Josh Harris books because much of his rationale was based on avoiding heartbreak. God calls us to love others and participate in relationships. Obviously, it’s unhealthy to shun intimacy because of the fear of “getting hurt.”
But neither is it useful, I think, to run towards relationships because you feel you deserve to be like everyone else or to “gain experience.” That’s just as shallow.
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I think it’s interesting also that people assume that just because someone hasn’t been in a romantic relationship that she hasn’t experienced the heartbreak or disappointment that can come from any intimate relationship, including those with friends and family. As I’ve already related, I’ve been hurt by a female friend far worse than a breakup with a boyfriend could have hurt. I’ve also been in a situation where someone I had a very intimate relationship with revealed to me, after two years of one of the best and (what I thought was the) most open and honest relationships of my life, that he’d been lying to me about a very important part of who he is.
So if *someone* believes that going through bad romantic relationships is the only way to grow and mature, I completely disagree.
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Wow, what an amazing discussion! Kaye, thanks for opening up to us. My experience is different, being married thrice, twice to the same man (whom I’m now married to). You can say I’ve had my share of baggage to deal with. I never married until I had come to the place in my life where I was a peace with the Lord being the Lover of my Soul. It is hard sometimes not to replace that during marriage. I know many women who are single and sometimes even have envied my love story (it is a beautiful redemptive one despite the tragedy I have endured), but it is not my story, it is God’s story. I try to encourage these friends of mine to let go of what the world is saying (I have my own experience with that!) about how their life should be. God has a unique story for each one of us. Easy for me to say, as I am married? Actually no, it has been a difficult journey for me in a different way.
Kaye, you are a lovely woman, beautiful, creative, intelligent! Why must people, including Christians, impose their ideals that one must be married to be complete and fulfilled. From talking to many women who are in unhappy marriages and my own experiences, I know this is not the answer. Thank you for sharing with your readers that romantic love can come at any age . . . or not.
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I’ve always said that I’d much rather never marry than to go through the pain of a divorce—and that point was hit home the last week or so as I edited a divorce-recovery book. It always thrills me to see success (blessing) stories of those who’ve not only come out okay on the other side of the divorce, but who’ve grown and been able to touch others through their experiences.
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I respectfully disagree. Saying you’ve never been on a date because no one has asked you out or because God hasn’t given you the opportunity *is* a cop out. You’ve never had the chance? No one has ever asked you out? It’s your responsibility to put yourself in a situation where you might be asked out, or even better, it’s your responsibility to *ask* someone out. You seem not willing to risk any kind of emotional pain, what you call “baggage”, which in the real world is how we grow and mature. No one wants to be rejected or have his or her heart broken, but it’s unavoidable, and despite what many of your commentators suggest, it *does* give you a broader perspective. You want a relationship? You want children? You will be hurt and you will have breakups and you will have arguments. You have no choice.
It’s your life, and if you’d rather remain unkissed for the rest of your life, that’s your business, but I promise you you *will* remain unkissed if you don’t start taking risks.
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I have tried to be the “aggressor” in the past—and been thoroughly humiliated. Though I know it’s not fair that men should always be the one to make the move to do the asking, I believe that there is quite a bit of biblical basis for that structure in the courtship ritual. The Bible tells men they are to be the head of the household, that women are to submit to their authority, so isn’t it going against biblical teaching for women to be going around being the aggressors?
And for you to say that I’ve never put myself in a situation where I might be asked out shows that you haven’t been reading my comments very well. Up until just a few years ago, I had more (and deeper) relationships with men than I did with women—yes, unmarried men. But out of the dozens of men I’ve been close with (including the male best friend I had from the time I was fifteen until he got married when we were in our late twenties), none of them ever saw me as “dating” material. Believe me, with as much as I wanted to have relationships in my younger years, I sought out opportunities where there might be the possibility I could be asked out—even though such situations are extremely stressful to me. In college, I got deeply involved in a large college/singles ministry at my church, in addition to the Baptist Student Union and Campus Crusade for Christ (where I was the only female on the music team with five or six men). In my early twenties, I got involved with a church singles group that enjoyed going out to bars to go dancing every weekend, and I went with them—I would even go early for the dancing lessons. Later, after I moved to Nashville, I again got involved in a large singles ministry at my church—teaching and organizing the activities. In the last ten years, I’ve used various “matchmaking”/online-dating sites . . . including being a somewhat active user of Match.com for the past six months.
So you see, you can’t just assume that I’m sitting around the house waiting for the phone to ring without putting myself into situations where I’m meeting people. But I also can’t go into every single social situation in my life with the idea in mind that I’m “shopping” for a mate. I did that for almost all of my 20s. And I believe that’s why I now have so few male friends. Because I stopped building friendships with them and started seeing them as a commodity. Now I just go where I go and do what I do and meet whom I meet without worrying about if there’s “potential” there for anything beyond friendship.
And to answer your questions. Yes, I want relationships—because I have a lot to give to more than just one single person in a relationship. No, I do not want children. God revealed to me many years ago that He has called me to remain childless. And if “taking risks” and getting hurt is what it takes to have a bad experience of a first relationship and a first kiss, then I’m fine with remaining unkissed.
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Well said, Kaye!
When the time is right, God brings the right person. I’m a bit of a recluse and don’t enjoy putting myself out there or being around lots of people. God knew that, and He brought my husband to me in a way that was comfortable for me. On the Internet. We’re an eHarmony success story.
God is ultimately in control of everything. When the time is right God brings that person to you. Whether you “put yourself out there” or not.
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You are unkissed, and most beloved.
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I suspect there are many, many, MANY more people out there in that situation, Kaye — and it’s not restricted to any one gender or body type. Our society spends so much time obsessing over romantic love and sex that it doesn’t realize there are many people who’ve never been sexually active (some don’t want to and some do), or people who’ve never dated, or keep waiting to fall in love with someone from work or school and it never has happened.
I’m a 36-year-old male, and I’ve written a one-act-play (produced locally), several poems, and some songs about the predicament of never finding love while it seems like everyone around you is/has.
So don’t feel too alone because you’re in your 30s and have never kissed anyone. (Though there are some questions for that. If someone has kissed you on the cheek or the hand or the forehead, then, yes, you have been kissed. I get upset when the “Affection Police” begin designating what “counts” and what “doesn’t count” — as if a sincere “I love you” and a kiss on the cheek is meaningless, while two college kids randomly making out at a frat party “counts” for something. I don’t buy that at all.)
Perhaps there should be a mini-revolution from those who are in this situation, as at the very least it will disabuse people of the myth that they are alone.
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Thank you for standing up for those of us who are single! I confess, I’ve not been single nearly as long as some (I’m only twenty). But it’s been hard the last couple years, watching all my friends start dating and/or get married. I nearly cried when I had to sit by myself at one friend’s wedding, and I nearly cried again when I was the only one of the wedding party at another friend’s wedding who had to walk into the reception all by myself.
On a different note altogether, I really enjoyed reading Meredith’s story! I grew up watching John Wayne movies, so I got a kick out of reading a book where a girl actually enjoyed them as well!
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I can definitely relate to you! 🙂 I was realizing today that all but one of my college roommates are married with two kids, or one with another on the way. My younger sister is now married and when she sent her invitations, my other younger sister’s boyfriend was invited but I wasn’t allowed to bring any sort of “date”. My extended family told me they wouldn’t even have noticed but it’s something that I certainly notice and it’s HARD.
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Wow this was very powerful to read.
I myself am 40ish and have never dated. It is so hard to find anyone in this position in life It’s been extremely difficult for me to watch my friends go out on dates ,Have relationships and get married. A lot of times I feel like I am standing out side a window of life looking in just waiting for someone to take a risk on me and giving me a chance to be in a relationship. I also have a very difficult time finding someone to talk to about all my feelings because none of my friends can totally understand what I am really saying. We as single people who have never dated need to take a stand and let the church know we are here we do exist and we really don’t appreciate been forgotten about. I’m just glad I am not going thru this alone that their are people out there who understand what I am saying and can sympathize instead of criticize. For all you christian ladies that have stopped going to church I want to encourage you that we are also out their we hate seeing people in relationships just as much as you do. I have gotten to the point in my life where I know that it is the desire of my heart to experience a loving relationship with someone and I do know God promises to give us the desires of our heart but God only gives us the desires of our heart if it aligns with his will for us. So for me personally I have given up or lost hope if you will in finding a soulmate or experiencing a relationship just so that I may be able to find peace and contentment. I am however open to the possibility that a relationship may still be in God’s will for me I just dont want to keep hoping in something like a loving relationship and find myself on my death bed someday and never having the opportunity to experience a relationship
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Kaye, I confess I have not before now encountered you or your books; it is this post and its comments that drew me from the land of search engines, where I was contemplating (again) what it means to be single, never-dated, never-kissed at the age of 30. Sites I’d seen before this one made me angry with their uniform assumption that this demographic simply can’t exist (… or the universe would implode? I dunno.).
It was so encouraging to read your confident and frank post, and all the comments thereafter. My church is a small one but singleness is still rare. The singles my age I knew when I began attending have since all married and most have had children. Of course, being at a small church means the prospects are very few indeed, but I decided years ago that “more single men” was not a basis on which I was prepared to change churches.
And the children part makes it even harder. Your comment about not intending to have children is what made me decide to comment. The first (and probably last) time I mentioned to friends (married, of course) that while I would like to be married I did not, however, intend to have children, I received an immediate reaction: “That’s so sad!” Well then. New conversation, shall we? So thank you for sharing on that item… when I’m feeling less rational I (mostly in fun) wonder whether I’m deficient in some way for not believing I’m called to motherhood!
I am a social and outgoing individual, and I’m doing a lot of things with my life. It just seems that the world around me seems only equipped to understand the model where marrying is an easy stepping stone (not an elusive mystery) and children are an assumption. On my best days I am grateful that I know many other single women in their thirties, forties, and on — I know I am not alone, and there isn’t anything pathologically wrong with me.
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It is comforting to know that one is not alone. I am in the same situation and I am almost 29 years old. I know this situation is abnormal. Most people have their first kiss when they are teenagers or young adults. I agree it is another situation all together when it is a conscious choice. It just sometimes feels like a slap in the face, when I think that in practically 29 years the opportunity has never presented itself. On occasion it can do a job on one’s self-esteem, especially when it feels like there is no one else in the same situation. Whenever my friends are discussing their relationships (which is quite often), in my mind I cannot help but think I am some sort of societal-romantic reject. None of my friends are aware (or at least I don’t think they are). I have never told them because I fear being treated or viewed differently. I feel I have a unique perspective not only on romantic relationships but life in general. I believe in embracing what sets us apart from each other and being thankful for what we have. I have come to accept my situation (even if it is permanent) with an open mind and heart. If the only love I ever have is that from God, family, and friends, that is already more then I deserve or hope for.
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I’m very glad to have discovered this place. I’m 44 and never have been in a relationship. I’m attractive and always ask myself why I’ve never had a boyfriend. I still try all the online dating sites. Actually right now I’m on three free sites and nothing. Most of the time I feel like I will die before I meet my soulmate if there is such a thing. I have been disappointed with quite a few online relationships that didn’t go anywhere beyond some e-mailling.
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I’m super late to this post, but it was a good one for me to read 🙂 At 26, I often feel alone in the subject. I have never dated anyone seriously. I’ve never been kissed. I’ve been on dates with two guys, one guy for one date and the other for two. Both were years ago. I’m not a bar girl, I am on some online sites at the (very, very persistent) urging of my mother who pretends sometimes to not care that I’m not married and other days is so on my case about it. When people ask why I’m not dating, I never know what to say. Uh, I haven’t met the right person???
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Like Els, I found this site/post through a search engine. I recently turned 29, & I guess for the last 4 or 5 years I have been feeling quite insecure & a bit down about being someone who has never had a boyfriend, been kissed & only ever been on 1 or 2 dates – that have probably scarred me for life, I might add! So, I find it very refreshing & pleasing that I found a post like this & am grateful in a way that the internet has allowed people like myself to discuss our situations & feelings in a more “anonymous” sort of way.
I get people telling me that I have an “attractive” or “pretty” face but need to lose weight (as I am a size 18) a guy at work even told me recently, “you really need to lose weight, you have to find a boyfriend eventually”. I have never told anybody that I have never had a boyfriend, but guess it’s obvious to people around me who have known me for years & see that I never bring anyone to events & social gatherings. I might add that I am a well-educated person for my age & am actually about to finish my 3rd university degree. But like Kaye & a few others have said the opportunity has never come up for me to kiss, date or be in a relationship with a guy. I too have tried online dating & ended up thinking I found someone that I really liked recently, but needless to say he didn’t feel the same & I just got very hurt in the end.
Dare I say I think most men are intimidated by intelligent, successful women. I’m not using this as an excuse to make myself feel better, but it is a definite observation that I have made.
But I guess my overall point is that the older I’m getting the more I am accepting that although I’m very different to most girls out there (who have slept with an average of 10-20 men), I am not abnormal. This is who I am & although it makes me quite sad at times, & this is worse when you feel you like someone & they just don’t feel the same, it’s still ok to be single & different to the vast majority.
Thanks for the great post & discussions! 🙂
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Ah this is a very good post. I don’t fall under the “never been kissed” category, but I’ve been only in one relationship and looking back, I’m surprised it even happened. With the exception of my ex, I’ve never been asked out on dates. I don’t even know of any guy who got a crush on me. I feel overlooked most of the time by men, and sometimes, by God.
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Thank you so much for sharing your story! I’ve thought for the longest that I am the only person in the world to reach 25 and never experience any form of romantic love. It’s become a joke amongst my friends and I, but it has always been something I felt ashamed of when asked about. I’m a teacher, so it’s been brought up more than once among my well-meaning students. 🙂 It’s comforting to know there are others not just waiting but truly living while searching for God’s purpose in their current season.
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I love that you were so open and honest in this post on singleness!
I understood, completely! We all deal with that but Black women deal with it times infinity: NBC Nightline did a news special on why Black women can’t get a man, there’s a viral DIY cartoon video on YouTube explaining the “reason” why Black women are single and a well-respected Psychology magazine published an article using statistics, charts and “facts” to explain why Black women are the LEAST attractive women in the world.
All three of those hateful forms of negativity against Black women happened in the past 3 years back-t-back. So yes, being a single woman is tough but it’s WORSE when you have the MEDIA and pop culture against you telling you what they believe is wrong with you and how you are inferior to all the other women in the world and THAT is why you are still SINGLE.
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Well , I am 44 almost 45 and have never had sex. I have been kisses defore but that honestly left about 12 years ago. I am in introvert, who falls for married men so this naked then unattainable. Oh yea, no date ever (never been asked) I am fat and un attractive. (Size 26/28) and have painfully accepted this is my life.
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I have noticed more and more churches are focused on this outcome (married and having babies) for all women. The church has tons of sermons and events for newly weds and young families, but the church never focuses on strong, single women. It’s hurtful. I would have liked a natural path of finding a great guy (or girl) and having many children, but that never happened. I’m in my 30s, have close family & fur babies, work long hours as a teacher, and try to find little joys where I can. But no husband. I may adopt later on, but the adoption fee is in the thousands of dollars. It’s hard to know where I fit in.
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